Type 1 size?

[G-Jet]

Apt33448,

Read my post again. A CAR COVER with reflective stripes. It would cover the entire car and not leave the the outriggers out there. Orange socks? No. Duh.

G

[Anthony]

G-Jet,
You don't like the idea of "Orange socks"? Why not? Actually you only need one of them on the street side. While parallel parking on the right (normal direction), you will not be able to see your right-hand outrigger from inside and you don't want to get "curb rash" so you leave a foot just to be safe. Well, now your left outrigger is almost 9 feet out into the road! Putting a traffic cone in front of it will stop cars from hitting it, but cones are a pain. A reflective "sock" that just goes over the outrigger would be easy to store, deploy and remove. You could put reflective tape strips all over it and round reflectors on the back edge. Sounds a lot easier than cones, a full car cover or even a flag.

[mycomya]

But I never drive within inches of the other parked cars, if only because THEY have side mirrors sticking out beyond their wheelbase
Problem seems: people will tend to equate the width of the body as about the same as the wheelbase (as it is for cars). The extra inches of leeway afforded for the sideview mirrors will probably not be enough to clear the low-lying outriggers (as they come around a corner, or whatever, otherwise distracted).

A reflective, custom cover that covers the entire vehicle _would_ do the trick... (since it doesn't exist, though, the problem potentially remains, IMHO).

I haven't read every post of this 26 page (!) conversation. Has anyone figured out the distance between the outer part of the cabin shell and the outer edge of the wheel pods? That is, by how much do the outriggers extend from the body?

[mycomya]

Can anyone tell I don't work on computers for a living? The blockquote thing still eludes me... !

(QUOTE)Sample text(/QUOTE) ... Replace ( ) with [ ]

[KarenRei]

Just an observation: there is a strong deterrent for Aptera (or any other car company) to make a vehicle (any vehicle) with dimensions exceeding 7'8" wide, 7'6" high, and 19'4", and especially for dimensions exceeding 8'0" wide, 7'4" high, and 19'11" long. It'd prevent them from using standard shipping containers.

http://www.foreign-trade.com/reference/ocean.cfm

[G.M.]

Of course they could ship the Aptera with the wheels not yet put on and have them put on once they get over-seas. Easier to do for the Aptera than trying to make an overside car fit. One can not easily make the Hummer less wide, but making the Aptera temporarily less wide is actually quite easy.

Also of course, over-seas shipping is pretty far away. Heck, buying an Aptera one state over in Arizona seems to be pretty far away.

G.M.

[Matthijs]

Just an observation: there is a strong deterrent for Aptera (or any other car company) to make a vehicle (any vehicle) with dimensions exceeding 7'8" wide, 7'6" high, and 19'4", and especially for dimensions exceeding 8'0" wide, 7'4" high, and 19'11" long. It'd prevent them from using standard shipping containers.

http://www.foreign-trade.com/reference/ocean.cfm

Karen, is this a response to my post on this thread? ForumLink (http://www.apteraforum.com/showthread.php?p=21316#post21316)

[KarenRei]

No, just something that I thought of after reading an article on a company that's invented collapsible shipping containers ;)

[thimel]

In another thread located here: http://www.apteraforum.com/showthread.php?t=2188, the actual width of the Aptera 2e was measured with a tape measure on Feb 3, 2009!

Here are the dimensions:


Width: precisely 91" across. (7' 7"). I know that won't make some of you happy... but I'm quite certain. That's from outer wheel skirt to outer wheel skirt.... measured with a tape measure laid under the vehicle in front of the tires.

The other dimensions were tougher to get without touching the car, so I won't claim they're 100% accurate, but very close.
LENGTH: 14' 10" long, (only a close approximation, my tape measure was 10' long so had to measure twice and had to eyeball start and end points next to the car so i wouldn't touch it.)
HEIGHT: about 52" tall. (rough approximation - had to just try to visually line it up against a tape measure next to the car... tough with the highly curved roof.

(The older prototype next to it was a full 4" taller. Looks even more than that, quite a visible difference in height as you'll see from the pics).



The estimate based on the picture in Hollywood was pretty close.

[Aptera#1434]

[QUOTE=thimel]In another thread located here: http://www.apteraforum.com/showthread.php?t=2188, the actual width of the Aptera 2e was measured with a tape measure on Feb 3, 2009!

My little Honda Insight is approximately 5'x11' which is dwafted by the Aptera at 7'7"x14'10".

I measured a BMW X5 SUV and it is 6'5"x15'.

Our parking spaces at work are only 7' wide!

I'm starting to worry about the width of the 2e.

[KarenRei]

[QUOTE=thimel]In another thread located here: http://www.apteraforum.com/showthread.php?t=2188, the actual width of the Aptera 2e was measured with a tape measure on Feb 3, 2009!

My little Honda Insight is approximately 5'x11' which is dwafted by the Aptera at 7'7"x14'10".

I measured a BMW X5 SUV and it is 6'5"x15'.

Our parking spaces at work are only 7' wide!

I'm starting to worry about the width of the 2e.

You could always mail Aptera and ask whether this will be the final width or not. Since the cat is out of the bag with Aptera's name on the number, they may be willing to address that.

[G-Jet]

Karen is right. try it. I would bet that is not the final pant design, or width.

G

[Cobraphx]

Karen is right. try it. I would bet that is not the final pant design, or width.

G

I wouldn't hold much hope that they can design new doors with windows that fully open, bring up the production line, and redesign the suspension system, in the 9 months they have left to meet their customer delivery date. Keep in mind they will build customer cars before the October date to build inventory, so less than 9 months to redesign the suspension and get it in production.

[mycomya]

Yeah, I don't think there's anyway to get around it (no pun intended!). Back to the drawing board...

As is, this beautiful thing is impossibly impractical (Karen fights a courageous but losing battle by arguing otherwise). They will lose A LOT of support if this is the final width.

[JimmyDreams]

I just went out into my driveway with my measuring tape.

It's fairly crowded with my Explorer and BMW 330 parked side by side.

The Aptera's stance it almost 2 feet wider than my Explorer.

:scared0011:

As much as it pains me to say this, the car would have to handle VERY well and be easily maneuvered to overcome the width of the front wheels to entice me to get it.

Driving it won't be bad, but parking it may be a pain. I want to test-drive one before I decide, but man....it's not looking too good when you stare at the measuring tape in the driveway.

:scared0006:

[Dubito]

I wouldn't hold much hope that they can design new doors with windows that fully open, bring up the production line, and redesign the suspension system, in the 9 months they have left to meet their customer delivery date. Keep in mind they will build customer cars before the October date to build inventory, so less than 9 months to redesign the suspension and get it in production.

Just wondering, what would be the point of building inventory before delivering cars to customers? Aptera couldn't use them as test vehicles or they'd have to sell the cars as used. Why not sell the first ones as soon as they're available and get press each time one is delivered? Like Tesla did. Probably a poor example.~

[evmavin]

I have a single car garage but it has a 10' door. With my truck inside there is not much room to move on each side, with the aptera it's really bad. I measured my truck in the street and it sits out farther than most cars on a normal width street, the Aptera measurements are so far out I think someone will hit it. It's funny when a NMG is like 43" wide and if you add more space for a second passenger it still is smaller. At that size it handled quite well.

[Ardie3301]

[QUOTE=thimel]In another thread located here: http://www.apteraforum.com/showthread.php?t=2188, the actual width of the Aptera 2e was measured with a tape measure on Feb 3, 2009!

My little Honda Insight is approximately 5'x11' which is dwafted by the Aptera at 7'7"x14'10".

I measured a BMW X5 SUV and it is 6'5"x15'.

Our parking spaces at work are only 7' wide!

I'm starting to worry about the width of the 2e.


(Grrr. This is getting on my nerves more than I would like to admit. I *must* speak out, but nobody should take this as a personal attack.)

Okay, everyone. So now we know how wide the 2e is (give or take a couple of inches). I'm not going to wimp out just because the Aptera is a bit wider than average.

I'm sure somone here on the forum has bought a new Ferrari, Porsche or some other incredibly expensive car. Do you think that those new owners *didn't* worry about dings in the parking lot?

What's the matter with y'all? Are you admitting you are some kind of inferior driver? Buck up, shut up, and keep it in the back of your mind come delivery acceptance time that you will have to show your better driving skills.

So the 2e will take a bit more skill and finesse in tighter spots. Rise to the occasion. Being a crybaby is soooo 1980's. No, wait. Its sooo 1990's. No, wait. It seems crybabies have been alive and well in any decade. :-(


-- Ardie
(/) crybabying

[aptera1213]

a) not worried abit about my driving abilities...they are top notch...not a single accident in 30 plus years of driving

i am a bit worried about the dolts out there that drive like crap and are texting on their phones and take out my front wheel


b) it might not even fit in my garage, which instantly makes it a non sale

c) not crying one bit...instead, like an adult, i will offer suggestions on improvements and, if they choose not to alter the vehicle, i will get an iMiEV, that i know will fit easily into my garage

[Matthijs]

[quote=Aptera#1434]


(Grrr. This is getting on my nerves more than I would like to admit. I *must* speak out, but nobody should take this as a personal attack.)

Okay, everyone. So now we know how wide the 2e is (give or take a couple of inches). I'm not going to wimp out just because the Aptera is a bit wider than average.

I'm sure somone here on the forum has bought a new Ferrari, Porsche or some other incredibly expensive car. Do you think that those new owners *didn't* worry about dings in the parking lot?

What's the matter with y'all? Are you admitting you are some kind of inferior driver? Buck up, shut up, and keep it in the back of your mind come delivery acceptance time that you will have to show your better driving skills.

So the 2e will take a bit more skill and finesse in tighter spots. Rise to the occasion. Being a crybaby is soooo 1980's. No, wait. Its sooo 1990's. No, wait. It seems crybabies have been alive and well in any decade. :-(


-- Ardie
(/) crybabying

Well I am no crybaby but I am in for a battle with the lawmakers in my country.
If I want to import one to Holland where a symmetrical 3 wheeler may not be wider then 78.7401575 inch I will have to lobby for an adaption in the law. Or I have to find an other European country to get an type approvall for this width and then try to get it onto Dutch roads. :(

[evmavin]

Driving skills? More like the bad drivers who will be hitting it in the parking lot or clipping the wheel when the wheel is sticking out on a hill when curbed. I can also see the cyclist who sues because the wheel is sticking out and they hit it at night. With the wheel curbed it looks like it will be out almost 100" or more! Add a few more from the curb and..

[butter]

All I care about is what someone pages ago already mentioned: parking at Trader Joe's, where I shop regularly.

Has anyone been to any TJs in the LA area? The ones I've been to, their parking lots are so incredibly crowded, and the spaces are tiny (though perfectly suited for my '99 Corolla).

And in general, I've been in more hairy, blood pressure-raising LA parking situations than I'd like to recall -- where I would be relieved that, at least, I was driving a nice little compact car that could slip in and out of spots in one try and slide between cars parked badly (or idling rudely in no-stopping/-parking zones), making for a smooth and easy escape.

Someone in another thread grumbled about people being crybabies, but this seriously extreme width isn't something I can just shrug off. Sure, I can change my driving and parking habits, sure I can torture myself when I'm rehearsing in Hollywood, driving around for 45 minutes searching for parking somewhere (I already do that now with my squeezable Corolla), and sure I can park in a different lot 5 LA blocks away so I can shop at Trader Joe's, whose parking lot has maybe one space left, and it's too small for me to fit my Aptera in -- but would all this hassle be worth it?

What makes me agonize so much over this is that everything else about the Aptera is pretty much perfect and ideal for me. Everything is so thrilling and fabulous and exceptional and practically my wildest dreams come true! Except for the width!!

It's just not feasible in LA unless you're willing to put up with the hassles of parking, and I just don't think I am.

I'm not ready to let go of my deposit, though, because until I get to test-park one of these in a space that's got an SUV on each side of me (a very common situation that I'm sure most of you recognize), I'll keep holding my breath.

Cause like I said, there is SO MUCH else about the Aptera that is too irresistible.

[evmavin]

They are distracting you with all the cool electronics. I wonder if the iphone integration alerts you when your front wheel has been torn off in the parking lot:)?

[futura]

What makes me agonize so much over this is that everything else about the Aptera is pretty much perfect and ideal for me. Everything is so thrilling and fabulous and exceptional and practically my wildest dreams come true! Except for the width!!
....
It's just not feasible in LA unless you're willing to put up with the hassles of parking, and I just don't think I am.
.....
Cause like I said, there is SO MUCH else about the Aptera that is too irresistible.

Butter, FWIW, I was the TJ's parking "crybaby" so, I hear you. I emailed Aptera today about this width issue. I think an excerpt from your post above would be reasonable for Aptera to see in an email as well. They need to know how significant this might be to their success.
Cheers

[rayfellow]

Why so wide? I remember driving a Harley Davidson 3 wheeler, back in the 60's and going up on two wheels because... well because I could and was stupid. Should I assume it's wide because it's unstable if narrow? I am trying to put myself in the minds of the Aptera design/engineering team coming up with - stable ride equals 91". How could they go forward with that design without checking in with the real world of driving/parking, and continue? Gad.. so many questions.. no answers.

It was intersting walking around with a tape measure pulled out to 91" and trying to imagine parking in the street, or parking in my drive way, or trying to go into my garage (not). Kind of knocked the wind out of my sails.

[evmavin]

I just spoke to a friend in SF, the standard size garage for single family homes is 8' wide on most of the pre-1970 homes which is most. That leaves a nice 2.5" clearance on each side. I think they may need a "wheel cam" option for parking rather than a back up cam.

[Apt3448]

My Lincoln Towncar measures about 1.5" less in width (mirror to mirror) than the 2e measurements. I have never been able to park at TJ's (horrible lot at 3rd and la Brea). Just park across the street at Ralphs. Relative to my current 'boat' there will be little difference in parking, so I'm not too worried about the width. Actually, the doors opening not much beyond those 91" will make egress handier than with my Lincoln in the driveway. The same for getting in the car on the drivers side in heavy traffic. It would be rather different in Amsterdam, where I'm from and where Matthijs is living. Their streets are actually narrower. Here in LA are so many huge cars -such as mine- that the 2e is not all that out of the ordinary. I understand some people have practical issues with driveways and garages, that is just too bad. But if that is not the case, I'd like to try and tell people you'll get used to the size, I have never thought of it as a big deal. I can always park somewhere (TJ's really being the exception), and I usually can fit in a 'compact' space. I've never lost a mirror.
Regarding the possibility of people clipping or hurting themselves on the outrigger wheel pants, we may just have to wait and see. I'm thinking though that with the very white pants, and the reflective strip on it, they are bigger and and al least as visible than those orange traffic cones, and those we (usually) notice, no?

[danieloneil01]

I can forsee alot of curb checking (might need those funny looking curb finders that you see on lowriders).

[Apt3448]

I can forsee alot of curb checking (might need those funny looking curb finders that you see on lowriders).
Probably, as we all tend to do with a new car. Eventually you get used to the size of the car and just 'know' how wide it is. Like you can eyeball whether you will fit in a curbside parking space. I cannot see my front bumper, but have somehow learned where it is. It will take time to get used to the size and shape of the 2e, no doubts, and in the beginning I will be very neurotic about what might happen. And after a while it just becomes the vehicle you drive.

[josh]

I just posted elsewhere that there's some new info - courtesy of Steve F. and Chairman of Aptera Bob Kavner. The width and specs are correct for THIS rev of Aptera, but the width issue "will be addressed pre-production". That's all I can say about it, but it sounds like there's not yet reason to panic about the 91" width.

[evmavin]

I have a solution, Aptera only parking. One pulls forward in a slot and in the next slot one backs in with the wheels tucked under the first, maximizing space. The only issue is the first must wait for the second to leave insuring Aptera friendliness.

When parking on streets a ramp may be placed on the wheel so oncoming traffic will go over the top, this includes skateboards and cyclists as well, BMX riders will love this feature as well as drivers who wish to get cars on two wheels.

Garages will have small swinging trap doors cut into the side that allow the wheels to slip through, these will double for outside pet access and small package deliveries.

I suspect that Aptera has planned for this and these modifications are part of the expensive upgrades that bring the car to $45K. These have been contracted through Home Depot and are a condition of the soon to be announced bailout funding Aptera will receive from the feds.

I also heard on a H2 forum that GM has been waiting to get the wheel width all this time so they could make their next EV wider then the Aptera, this explains the silence. It's the Type double e wide.

Reflective tape and flashing cones optional...

[jsnable]

Late-breaking update re:width:

http://apteraforum.com/showpost.php?p=26281&postcount=83

Jay

[Matthijs]

I just posted elsewhere that there's some new info - courtesy of Steve F. and Chairman of Aptera Bob Kavner. The width and specs are correct for THIS rev of Aptera, but the width issue "will be addressed pre-production". That's all I can say about it, but it sounds like there's not yet reason to panic about the 91" width.

So I can still hope! :) I am no engineer but what would be the most narrow width Aptera can use considering it's length and other parameters of this layout?

[NeilBlanchard]

Hi,

What's the most tipping force that can be induced by driving on an off-camber, downhill, hard turn [with the tires underinflated] -- that requires hard braking?

[Aptera#1434]

[QUOTE=Aptera#1434]

You could always mail Aptera and ask whether this will be the final width or not. Since the cat is out of the bag with Aptera's name on the number, they may be willing to address that.

Thanks Karen, but I think I will go with Josh's thread in"Type1 size" #280 listing
and have a wait and see attitude. I am encouraged by what he wrote.:thumbsup:

[KarenRei]

[QUOTE=KarenRei]

Thanks Karen, but I think I will go with Josh's thread in"Type1 size" #280 listing
and have a wait and see attitude. I am encouraged by what he wrote.:thumbsup:

Hey, I posted that before Josh posted :happy0025:

[Aptera#1434]

[QUOTE=Aptera#1434]

Hey, I posted that before Josh posted :happy0025:

True:love0002:

I really appreciate all your technical knowledge and contribution to this forum!

[KarenRei]

We all do our part. :)

[JakesOnline]

I love to say I told ya so!

I was only 2 inches off.

http://www.apteraforum.com/showthread.php?t=2188

My estimate for the width is 7 3/4 feet.

http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/4024/apterawidthem8.jpg

[Matthijs]

Lol now I recognize the trailer and Silverrado on the right!

[KarenRei]

Lol now I recognize the trailer and Silverrado on the right!

Lol!

This is like watching Donnie Darko or Serial Experiments Lain a second time -- you catch all sorts of things that you missed before. ;)

[Matthijs]

Also an interesting shot from Anthony:

http://www.apteraforum.com/images/_anthony/1.JPG
The back-end of the Aptera is only 58" (147 cm) in width.