Apples and Oranges.

[Dubito]

You guys probably saw this a long time ago, but when I read last year about the Vectrix electric scooter I thought it was interesting, but my two-wheeled days are over and it is ugly, not smart-looking like a Vespa.
Turns out the company made over 2000 electric scooters in 2007 and sold a grand total of 123. Looks like they’ve spent over $9 million and as expensive as the scooter is, that’s no business plan.
I figure the aptera won’t have these same problems: Aptera has great styling, is much more usable/stable (enclosed, can haul groceries etc.), and compared w/ $12,000 for a scooter, seems priced well.

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/01/21/vectrix-2007-maxi-scooter-sales-severely-disappointing/

[futura]

...although the issue of Aptera's cost has been debated a bit here. I've followed Vectrix a little for the past 6 months. They seemed like an OK concept (style is subjective), 60 miles per charge with a good push (0-60, 8 sec; I recall). Two things killed them IMO, cost ($12K!) and quality. Turns out the crappy NiMH batteries weren't getting but 30-40 mi/charge and the Polish production quality wasn't too hot either. Stock has fallen from $50 to $6.50.
There are few distribution centers also.

I still think Aptera is pushing the cost a bit high (not so much as Vectrix). But if their quality is high, they'll find a steady stream of buyers I think.
Cheers.

[DDB]

...although the issue of Aptera's cost has been debated a bit here. I've followed Vectrix a little for the past 6 months. They seemed like an OK concept (style is subjective), 60 miles per charge with a good push (0-60, 8 sec; I recall). Two things killed them IMO, cost ($12K!) and quality. Turns out the crappy NiMH batteries weren't getting but 30-40 mi/charge and the Polish production quality wasn't too hot either. Stock has fallen from $50 to $6.50.
There are few distribution centers also.

I still think Aptera is pushing the cost a bit high (not so much as Vectrix). But if their quality is high, they'll find a steady stream of buyers I think.
Cheers.

For the sake of Evs Vetrix better not be dead. $12K isn't that unreasonable in light of what we spend over in oil producing countries (sigh) :mad: My point is that the EV community has been touting Vetrix for years now, and to see them struggling without so much as a splash is not a good sign for any of us, Aptera included. I hope municipalities and others see the light.

[KarenRei]

12k is unreasonable for a scooter. It's very unreasonable. I'm sure that the price is at least 80% of the reason for the lack of sales. When people buy a scooter, they're generally wanting to get around without having to put forward a lot of cash. And that's a lot of cash.

27k$ for a car is not a lot of money. Look at all of the people who put down almost that much for a Prius. Yes, the Aptera is technically a motorcycle, but functionally, it's a car. I think the only real strike against the Typ-1e is that it's a 2 1/2 seater, which isn't particularly popular in the US.

[Dubito]

KarenRei,
I agree w/ you re: price, but we’re still a ways out before delivery. Tesla had many costly delays and while I have faith in Fambro and his team, what happens if because of batteries, or unforeseen costs he can’t meet the promised price and it comes in at $35K? Aptera could languish like the Vectrix.

[futura]

Dubito,

I agree, and I've posted arguments about cost already. If Aptera monitors this forum it might be useful for them to have a handle on how sensitive the faithful (those who've put down the $0.5k on a promise) are to price. I'm good for another $5k on an "e" but I am motivated beyond ROI. I don't know how inelastic the demand for Aptera may be; but Fambro and Co. will have to adjust their design/delivery trade-offs accordingly.
Cheers.

[palmer_md]

If your looking for an electric motorcycle, this is a much better deal at $7450.

http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/video.php

[Dubito]

All my motorcycle riding was on pavement.
Specs on the Zero Motorcycle say the motor is brushed. I would have thought powerful motors for vehicles would be brushless. I'm assuming this means there’ll need to be motor maintenance when the brushes wear out. Does anyone know if the Aptera has a brushed motor?

[GCustom]

does anyone remember the Voloci?

http://nycewheels.com/voloci-nimh-electric-motorbike.html

[Dubito]

Looks like the Voloci is discontinued, but there appear to be many good electric assist or full electric bikes for sale at between $1K-$3.5K. No wonder the Vectrix doesn’t sell at $12K.

http://nycewheels.com/bikes.html

[DDB]

Dubito,

I'm good for another $5k on an "e" but I am motivated beyond ROI.

Isn't that the true motivation for most all EV enthusists today? Early adopters are NOT trying to save a buck. They'll mention money when it supports their argument. But my goal is to give the middle finger to the oil peddlers. I'll pay a premium.

[KarenRei]

Hey, my *father* is an oil peddler! :) My Aptera will be bought partly with "oil peddler" money :)

My reasons for purchasing it are to help move us into the future (the stats behind the tech and what's currently in the lab make it clear that EVs are *the way* to go) and to help the environment, at little cost to myself because of the cost savings of EVs.

[qpham63]

Isn't that the true motivation for most all EV enthusists today? Early adopters are NOT trying to save a buck. They'll mention money when it supports their argument. But my goal is to give the middle finger to the oil peddlers. I'll pay a premium.


There are so few of us that price must be a consideration. I did some analysis for a single seater that runs on small displacement ICE just to satisfy the Valley/Bay Area of Norcal commuters. At $7K, the savings on fuel will pay for the vehicle and if that allows the use of commuter lane and the vehicle enclosed for comfortable 95% weather use, it would earn a place on just fuel savings this is when gas was ~$2.5/gal. It is now another 1$ and increasing beyond that.

There are many variables but bottom line is the public is not going to sacrifice much to be green. We have seen that when gas go up SUV sales goes down and when gas price goes down SUV sales go up...simple a solution need to be inexpensive. The class the VEXTRIX was in it need to be sub $7K and offer better range as well as better weather protection.

I have to admit, I would not replace my sedan but only add to the collection. When I am set in ways to make the best use of it, perhaps the sedan can go but the all hauling/trailer towing seating 7 for the extended family MDX to haul us to the Tahoe has to stay for now.:o

With the way fuel prices is climbing and hopefully battery technology/maturity of the technology will bring the formula to the point where the Aptera would be a no brainer even to those who could careless about cool aerodynamics or going green but only interested in saving GREEN. No matter what the impetus is. The end result is the same.

High level of consumerism for the product for those of us who would buy one even at $35K would simply makes it available to us for less. At least, that is what I think.:D

You know I would not mind an Aptera glider to couple with a small displacement diesel engine set up to run on strained Mac Donnal's deep fryer grease. You can be powered in efficient style while smelling like french fries. Ha Ha.;)