Leaf orders starting August!

[Marc]

Just got this from Nissan:

Marc, thank you for reserving a Nissan LEAF™. you live in an area that will be one of the first to start the order process, which begins in August and continues for the next few months. during this time, you'll be notified when to contact your dealer. together, you will confirm your options, and talk about price, trade-ins and any incentives that are available.

Woot!

:happy0017:

So far, so good!

[aptera1213]

I got that too...of course I'm not in a start up city, but I use my daughter's Phoenix address...I will be flat bedding it to Albuquerque day one of life:)

Gavin

[plainar]

I'm also in one of the start up cities. I don't want to get too excited, but I can't wait!

[Spies]

I wish I was in a start up city :(

[solardude]

I got the same email, as i am in a start up city. exciting! Man, Aptera could learn a great lesson from the great, encouraging communications by Nissan.

[mycomya]

I've heard conflicting information... In California, will the first Leafs be delivered to the local dealerships of the first reservation holders (wherever they are in the state) or just to the folks in San Diego? Does anyone know?

I asked a salesperson at a San Diego dealership this morning and he said that the first cars would be delivered to the first people who completed the process (reservation, home assessment, etc.), regardless of area. I was surprised by this... I had thought the first 1000 cars in California would all go through San Diego and vehicle roll out would continue in the other parts of the state come Spring 2011... just as the Aptera was originally sleighted to roll.

[gistmarrs]

I'm 300 miles north of San Diego and I got the e-mail that said I was in a start up city and would be contacted by the dealer to go over details for the August delivery.

[aptera1213]

Seems the first round goes to most of southern cal, not just san diego...heck, maybe all of Cali??...seems Houston is also added to the early owners...

too bad Albuquerque isn't, it would save me having to rent a flat bed truck.

on the up side, I have a daughter and Phoenix and used her address, so I should get a LEAF come Dec. Yeah. Finally will be an EV owner.

Gavin

[mycomya]

I received the email, too, but it said, "you live in an area that will be one of the first to start the order process." I wonder if this message was the same for everyone in California, including San Diego area? I.e., was there a difference for those in San Diego, did the email say 'city' or 'area'? Just curious...

Roll out may be city-centric outside of California but statewide for California...?

[scottsim]

Same email...out here in the CA boonies.

[Aptera#1434]

I received the same email, San Carlos, CA (25 miles South of San Francisco).

[Spies]

Well what do you know. My significant other got the email as well. Perhaps I will be getting the email too since we both put down deposits. There is hope for me yet :)

[aptera1213]

Cool...so with Oregon and Washington, basically the whole West Coast is a Nissan Start-up center. Sweet. Well sweet for the approximately 50 million people who live on the West Coast... :)

Gavin

[NeilBlanchard]

Boston area is as well -- my sister-in-law has a deposit down, and I could have, but it is not a good fit for me, financially, at the moment. Plus, I'm hoping for something even more efficient...

[AndyH]

We have four Texans on the list - two DFW, 1 Houston, and 1 San Antonio and we're all in initial roll out areas. It strongly appears that Nissan will use what it calls a 'corridor' release rather than liming initial sales to just a few cities or urban areas.

http://www.absoluteefficiency.com/LEAF/corridor.jpg

[evmavin]

Anyone know what the color coded tacks indicate?

[AndyH]

But of course! :biggrin:

http://absoluteefficiency.com/LEAF/tacks.jpg

Nissan has a number of briefings floating around in cyberspace that outline their marketing areas, infrastructure development efforts, and strategic partnerships. They're working with power companies and cities to encourage streamlined permitting for private EVSE, as well as public charge point infrastructure, and incentives prior to roll-out of the Leaf. (See Oct 09 PDF pages 29-33.)

Leaf - Oct09 (http://absoluteefficiency.com/LEAF/NissanLeaf_Oct09.pdf)
Leaf - Jan10 (http://absoluteefficiency.com/LEAF/NissanLeaf_Jan10.pdf)
Leaf - Mar10 1 (http://absoluteefficiency.com/LEAF/NissanLeaf_Mar10.pdf)
Leaf - Mar10 2 (http://absoluteefficiency.com/LEAF/NissanLeaf_March 2010_evse.pdf)

Andy

[aptera1213]

Andy, why as some states blue?

Gavin

[AndyH]

Andy, why as some states blue?

Gavin

Umm..umm...because they don't have their Leafs yet?

(sorry...)

Don't know for sure. Maybe they have an agreement with the power company that covers the entire state?

[minden]

Dang, nothing here in Nevada. Well looks kewl. Good deal for those in a start up area.

[Marc]

Well I saw the leaf at the TOC Stage 8 event... Wow. Much nicer in person than in the photos. Unfortunately I do not have good pictures, but at least I got a nice Leaf thumb drive and a cycling hat. :) It is a sweet looking ride, and quite roomy inside.

[NeilBlanchard]

The 2011 Leaf is sold out:

http://green.autoblog.com/2010/05/25/carlos-ghosn-2011-nissan-leaf-sold-out/

[jhm614]

Well I saw the leaf at the TOC Stage 8 event... Wow. Much nicer in person than in the photos ... It is a sweet looking ride, and quite roomy inside.

That's good news! Could you tell anything about the rear seating? Could an adult sit in backseat without having their knees compressed into their chest?

[SlowSRT4]

That's good news! Could you tell anything about the rear seating? Could an adult sit in backseat without having their knees compressed into their chest?
Go sit in a Dodge Caliber and you will have your answer.

[NeilBlanchard]

Paul Scott has a test drive in a pre-production Leaf:

http://evsandenergy.blogspot.com/2010/06/testing-leaf-on-nissans-yokohama-track.html

Spoiler alert -- he likes it a lot.

[SEGsby]

I love this quote:

"The car responded perfectly, hugging the road and steering predictably. I learned later that this is a consequence of having the bulk of the weight distributed tightly in the lower center of the car. This eliminates yaw of the vehicle when turning hard."

Seems like another design lesson "Team B" should have implemented, at Aptera.

GuQIRoE_jcE
Slomo Track Test XPrize (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuQIRoE_jcE)

[palmer_md]

Does anybody have an August order date? Ordering starts tomorrow. I have a September order date. Looking forward to seeing how this process moves along.

[Aptera#1434]

Does anybody have an August order date? Ordering starts tomorrow. I have a September order date. Looking forward to seeing how this process moves along.

September for me too. I heard the August batch is very limited in numbers.

[futura]

I'm an August.
We'll see how it goes tomorrow.

[Stunt Driver]

Seems like another design lesson "Team B" should have implemented, at Aptera.

GuQIRoE_jcE
Slomo Track Test XPrize (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuQIRoE_jcE)

Well, looking at this video - i wouldn't buy Aptera. I really hope they can fix it all.

[NeilBlanchard]

They fixed the major handling problem and the door opening problem. They may need to rearrange the battery pack, and lighten the vehicle, but the problem in this video are no more.

[Stunt Driver]

problem in that video - is that it's out in public..... was it so hard to test before event?.... so mad.....

I'm still preferring Aptera to Lelf if at the same or lower price

[jhm614]

well... it's official... I have ordered a Leaf for January, 2011 delivery. Because I live in Texas, I was never able to put down a deposit on an Aptera. But I still had a twinge of regret when I hit "accept" after reviewing my Nissan dealer's quote. Actually, it is probably good that I couldn't put down a 2e deposit, because I'm sure I would have locked in. Still, for me, this feels like bitter sweet closure. I'm reducing my carbon footprint and that is the most important thing. But, man, I wanted the uber-cool California car to be my first electric.

[AndyH]

Hey Jason - just a 'me too' - I guess it's Texas Day at Nissan! ;)

I too looked forward to the 49-states roll-out of the Aptera so I could get in line but I guess this is one of those 'Thank God for unanswered prayers' things. :character0009:

Tchüss, Aptera...

[SlowSRT4]

well... it's official... I have ordered a Leaf for January, 2011 delivery. Because I live in Texas, I was never able to put down a deposit on an Aptera. But I still had a twinge of regret when I hit "accept" after reviewing my Nissan dealer's quote. Actually, it is probably good that I couldn't put down a 2e deposit, because I'm sure I would have locked in. Still, for me, this feels like bitter sweet closure. I'm reducing my carbon footprint and that is the most important thing. But, man, I wanted the uber-cool California car to be my first electric.
You might be increasing your carbon footprint. The lithium is shipped from Canada to China to be processed, then to Japan to be assembled into the final batteries. Then the whole car is shipped here.

That's a lot more carbon spent shipping things around compared to a car with most parts sourced from NA, built in NA, and sold in NA.

[NeilBlanchard]

Virtually the same energy goes into making ICE powered cars, too. If there are differences, they are most likely very small.

The fuel used by ICE's and the lubrication oil and other disposables used in regular maintenance completely swamp any differences in manufacturing. And it is here where EV's can/will make a difference.

[SlowSRT4]

Virtually the same energy goes into making ICE powered cars, too. If there are differences, they are most likely very small.

The fuel used by ICE's and the lubrication oil and other disposables used in regular maintenance completely swamp any differences in manufacturing. And it is here where EV's can/will make a difference.
I wasn't referring specifically to ICE cars. An EV with most of its production enclosed in NA and then sold here will obviously have a significantly lower carbon footprint than the Leaf.

And the disposables you are referring to only include engine oil, which has longer change cycles these days than the old 3k standard. Modern transmissions are sealed so there is no more changing transmission fluid.

[evmavin]

Just ordered today and confirmed a price far below MSRP!

[jhm614]

Just ordered today and confirmed a price far below MSRP!

Alright!

That's a lot more carbon spent shipping things around compared to a car with most parts sourced from NA, built in NA, and sold in NA.

Good point but my current car was shipped from France (Mini), so I was already guilty there. Plus, since I'm Texas based, I couldn't order an Aptera...

[evnow]

I wasn't referring specifically to ICE cars. An EV with most of its production enclosed in NA and then sold here will obviously have a significantly lower carbon footprint than the Leaf.

I'd save on emissions even if I buy from Japan now instead of an EV made here in 2013.

BTW, anyone thinks Aptera will sell before US made Leafs ?

[SlowSRT4]

I'm not advocating Aptera, haha. Given up on that a while ago.

[PatQ562]

NeilBlanchard:
The fuel used by ICE's and the lubrication oil and other disposables used in regular maintenance completely swamp any differences in manufacturing. And it is here where EV's can/will make a difference.

Actually, it is not obvious that lifetime fuel usage "swamps" the impact of manufacturing an automobile. It's very difficult to ascertain the environmental impact of manufacturing a car but we can make some guesses. A typical $20K car getting about 20mpg will use $15,000 worth of gasoline every 100,000 miles. You can decide what its average useful life is, but overall, the cost of the car is roughly equal to the cost of fuel over its lifetime. Steel manufacturing uses coal, and many other automobile materials impact the environment. We know that oil extraction and automotive raw materials all involve some degree of harm, so the overall cost of a complex industrial process is as good a metric as any for estimated total footprint - if two different things cost $20K, they probably have similar mining impacts, people driving to their jobs, trucks hauling goods back and forth etc etc.

I support EVs in the hopes of greatly reduced future costs due to volume, and in the hope of improved clean energy sources.

Pat Q

[NeilBlanchard]

You are right Pat, for each car, the embedded energy in manufacturing is probably higher than lifetime fuel use. Especially ICE powered cars, where the lifetime is probably shorter than the chassis of the EV.

My point however, was that when comparing the energy to make and run an EV vs the energy to make and run an ICV (to coin an acronym?), it is the fuel used by the ICV that swamps the rest. Even if you add recycling of the battery pack as you replace it (several times?) over the life of the car.

[evnow]

We know that oil extraction and automotive raw materials all involve some degree of harm, so the overall cost of a complex industrial process is as good a metric as any for estimated total footprint - if two different things cost $20K, they probably have similar mining impacts, people driving to their jobs, trucks hauling goods back and forth etc etc.

Not even close. There are cradle to grave studies on cars that have been done. An average ICE car's non-running carbon footprint is about equal to its one year emissions. You can easily get the references, so I won't try to find any now.

Purely from an energy input POV (not emissions) - Prius uses 113MBTU or the equivalent of 911 gallons of gas.

http://www.slate.com/id/2194989