Do you have 220 Volts available at home?

[speculawyer]

Originally Posted by Todd

I'm thinking of paving and covering the back yard with solar panels anyways. Power with the added bonus of killing the evil always needing to be mowed grass.

Why in the world would you not put them on the roof?!?!?!

If Homeowner Association is your answer, then I'd recommend you research that since many (if not most) states have laws that invalidate any HOA provisions that prevent PV installations.

[garygid]

daddio,
I can see paying $1 for 50 cents worth of electricity (maybe 2 kWh),
but if it is $5 per kWh, then I would only use it in an emergency.
And, without significant usage, the infrastructure would not get built.

In Los Angeles, they just opened the first Hydrogen fueling station,
and have budgeted something like 7.7 MILLION dollars for TWO more.
Pardon me, NOT a good way to use my tax dollars, just to feed
a few fuel cell vehicles.

[Matthijs]

Originally Posted by KarenRei

Do you know what the standard is called, though? Most outlets in the US meet some NEMA standard or another. Is there some standards body that covers outlets like that?

It's called the EuroPlug Type C CEE 7/16, Type C CEE 7-17, Type F CEE 7/4 Schuko and Type E & F hybride CEE 7/7.

I found a good site on plugs around the world here: Worldstandards and Here

[rotus8]

The different power connectors around the world is a big pain. We have a large shelf in my company to hold all the different power cords we have to ship, depending on the destination of the equipment.

My favorite is the UK plug that is rated for 15 amps but is big enough for about 50.

[KarenRei]

Thanks, Matthijs. I've been idly working on a better version of evchargermaps.com that'll let people add and query any kind of information about home or commercial charging installations easily and automatically, and which should be easier to keep current by use of a trust network. I've got all of the NEMA sockets in the database (there's 50 or so of them), as well as Avcon, small paddle, and large-paddle chargers. I'll check out those pages you linked and add them to the database.

The different power connectors around the world is a big pain

Just for me, even things like the help metadata is a real pain. For example, frequencies. Here's how I described the frequencies in the DB so far:

0Hz: DC
50Hz: AC. Europe, Asia (excepting western Japan), the Middle East (excepting Saudi Arabia), Africa (excepting parts of Liberia), Australia, Oceania (excepting the Phillipines), French Guyana, and South America south of Brazil and Peru.
60Hz: AC. North America, South America north of and including Brazil and Peru (excepting French Guyana), western Japan, parts of Liberia, and the Phillipines.

That was about the most concise I could make the descriptions. :P There are too many competing standards on every aspect of power transmission. If people had to standardize, I'd much rather see standardization on 220V than 110V. 110V became the standard in the west mainly for one reason: incandescent light bulbs :P As for frequency, there's not much of a functional difference.

[daddio]

Gary,
I agree the infustructure is not their yet....
In the case of my gas vehicle...I don't use the higher gas price stations except for emergency
There may be more emergencies with the 1e for folks pushing it beyond what "they thought" would be their max. range... Just a nice thought "If possible/available". Maybe Aptera's road service will have the answers and start the ball rolling in this regard
Benchmark.. as they say

[n_dawg]

Originally Posted by KarenRei

small paddle, and large-paddle chargers.

Woohoo, Magne Charge!

Seriously though, it's pretty clear that in the long-term there's going to be a network of high-current charging stations that load-level with batteries. These are *much* easier/cheaper to install than hydrogen fueling stations or gasoline pumps, and at least as convenient as both.

So, at home you trickle charge for 5¢-10¢/kWh.

In a pinch (or for long trips), you take 10 minutes to charge at a high-current station for 25¢-50¢/kWh. You're still paying dramatically less than you would for gasoline, and you avoid the fumes and spills.

[rotus8]

I got this from a friend of mine:

"The standard for EV charging systems has been formulated by the SAE. The committee working on the standard is J1772. A standard has been in place for about ten years or more. What the committee is doing now is updating the standard to accommodate products which go to 70A. The old standard would go to 50A. We had to redefine the pilot signal interface to communicate the new higher currents to the vehicle.

"The committee has also defined a new EV connector which all the OEMs will use in the future. The connector is different from anything in use today. The old Avcon connector used on conductive EV charging systems in the past was very expensive, prone to breaking and would not handle the new higher currents. The connector design in process right now at Yazaki will be an open standard. The same shell size will accommodate chargers from 12A to 70A so all chargers will be the same interface. The new connector will probably not be in production until Q2 of 2009 so everyone will use their proprietary connectors until then."

The J1773 spec belongs to the SAE and is not publicly available unless you pay for it. The old spec is available for $59, but this is the old one from 2001. The new one should be available soon.

Old Version:
http://www.sae.org/technical/standards/J1772_200111

New Version:
http://www.sae.org/servlets/productDetail?PROD_TYP=STD&PROD_CD=J1772&HIER_CD=T EVHYB&WIP_SW=YES


Here is an article on some changes being made.
http://http://www.theautochannel.com...ess012917.html

[KarenRei]

This announcement just gives me a big round of "Huh?"s. They're updating the standard... but only upping the max current from 50 to 70A? Meanwhile, I know of at least two companies (AltairNano and Epyon) making chargers to deal in the hundreds of kilowatts -- many hundreds of amps. If you're going to make a fixed-installation charger, what's the point if it's not a fast charger? You can get a 50A onboard charger for a couple dozen pounds and plug a cord from any standard NEMA 50A outlet into it. Why make people have to deal with the pain of having to find some special charger that you'd need hundreds of thousands of installations to provide national coverage when you don't have to?

This just doesn't make sense to me.

[rotus8]

Originally Posted by KarenRei

This announcement just gives me a big round of "Huh?"s. They're updating the standard... but only upping the max current from 50 to 70A? Meanwhile, I know of at least two companies (AltairNano and Epyon) making chargers to deal in the hundreds of kilowatts -- many hundreds of amps. If you're going to make a fixed-installation charger, what's the point if it's not a fast charger? You can get a 50A onboard charger for a couple dozen pounds and plug a cord from any standard NEMA 50A outlet into it. Why make people have to deal with the pain of having to find some special charger that you'd need hundreds of thousands of installations to provide national coverage when you don't have to?

This just doesn't make sense to me.

How do you make a flexible connection that delivers "hundreds of kilowatts"? 70 amps at 400 volts is 28 Kilowatts. You will need either a cable as thick as your thigh, or you need to be running the voltage at multiple KV. Doesn't make sense to me.